P.Meister

Both car's are amazing. I love the styling cue's on the mach, and the cobra. The mach has a solid rear, which is lighter, an aluminum block, which is also lighter

Weight Advantage = Mach

The mach motor is good to about 450rwhp, the cobra motor is good to about 700-800rwhp with a mild tune and proper gas.

Stock Block Power Potential = Cobra

So, at the end of the day, the choice is yours. The cobra motor will take more abuse, longer.

MYSTICAL

I like them both, it just depends on what you plan to do with the car. Are you going to keep it stock or modify it? Machs are strong runners and don't need much more than exhaust and a gear (4.30-4.56) to pull a stock cobra. Cobras are much heavier with the iron block, sc, intercooler, 6-spd, irs etc., etc. Also, their forged shortblock has proven to be far from bulletproof. The piston to wall clearance is way too tight. Forged pistons expand much more than hypereutectic ones. Therefore, the piston to wall clearance must be greater in order to account for the thermal expansion. Too tight of a p-w clearance like in the 03-04 cobras can cause scoring of the piston and cylinder bore. The brillient engineers at Ford decided to build them this way in order to eliminate the piston slap that was being heard on cold startup and as a result, many 03-04's have blown up. The cobras major advantage is that they can be made fast for cheap. With the money you are planning on spending on a mach or cobra, personally, I would have kept your 98 and built it. It's just whatever floats your boat.

White97

The Machs are very nice but at the end of the day I would much rather have the Cobra. But I guess I'm a bit biased...

Terminal Velocity

lol well your damn near there just a couple of valves and a huff'r away

OVERKILL

iTrader: (3)

This is an interesting post.

Excessive piston expansion, especially in forged slugs, is due to pressure and heat. I'm sure at STOCK boost levels, the piston to wall clearance is more than adequate.

When somebody builds a RACE engine that they are throwing massive amounts of boost at, they increase the piston to wall clearance accordingly, to compensate for the expansion that occurs.

The 87-92 motors, with the forged TRW slugs, had looser piston to wall clearances than the late '92, 93, 94, 95 engines with the Hypereutectic pistons due to thermal expansion of the forged pieces.

As with any assembly line engine, even when its being put together by people, tollerances vary. I'm quite sure that some of the Cobra engines are looser than others, and some are tighter. Those with the looser engines will get away with more boost, those with the tighter engines, if pushed past stock boost levels, have to potential for wall scoring, or, in more severe cases, a piston seizing in the bore, causing serious damage.

How do you check? Well, you take it apart, but most people just want to slap a bigger blower on it or a smaller pulley and be done with it. Most will be lucky. But, of course, I'm sure, there are the few that have had the "issues" that you mention above.

Do you have any numbers?

jibbijib

I'd go with a Mach. The Cobra is kick *** and all, but you expect it to kick ***. The Mach doesn't look so mean, it looks clean, but when you get in it and drive it, it kicks you in the ***** and takes your lunch money. I got to ride in one, and I'm telling you, the view from the cockpit is nice. It's awesome to see the shaker hood in action. Maybe my opinion will change if I get a ride in a Cobra, but as for now, the Mach rubs me the right way. It's sutble, but surprising. Nice touch.

MYSTICAL

There have been bone stock cars at stock boost levels that have blown up. The eaton is a heat producing inefficient blower. It produces max boost early and holds it there through the rev range. The .001 piston to wall clearance in the 03-04 cobras is way too tight for a FI forged motor regardless of boost level and does not take into account the thermal expansion characteristics of forged slugs. Below are just a few examples of blown-up terminators. Mind you some of them are as a result of a bad tune and/or operator error or other causes, however, how would you explain the stockers and all the others that have blown up? Clearly many of them can be attributed to the flawed p-w clearance.

mustang500hp (Stock): Galled #2 piston suspect due to low piston clearance. Failed at 2k mi.

03RedCobra (Stock): Blown head gasket, filled all the cylinders up with fluid, and it had to be replaced. It was BONE stock, even down to the filter. Failed at 1,700 mi.

RedSquad7 (Stock): Thrown rod at 1,286 mi!

smytty001 (Stock): Piston #7 damaged at 2.7 kmi. Stock except for CB.

John1975 (Eaton 2.93” upper, x psi, 433/_ rwhp/tq): Suspect blown #2 piston. Failed after 3 high-speed (135-155 mph) runs. A/F = 10.9-11.7:1 right up to redline. Octane = 94. K&N FIPK. Engine failed at 3.5k mi. Modded for 1.5k mi.

RedSquad7 (Eaton w/ 2.93” upper, 13-14 psi, 459/456 rwhp/tq on DJ): 2/4/05. 2nd Engine. Burned piston #2 after high-speed run (155-160 mph) during which several vacuum lines came off. A/F = 12.0-12.2:1 (at tailpipe). Octane = ?. Total timing = ?. 9” open K&N. Stock fuel sys. Bassani catted X and CB. Modded for ~2 kmi. Predator custom tune. Engine failed at ~10 kmi.

Copperhead - SVTP (Eaton 2.8” upper, _ psi, 430/400 rwhp/tq now): Low compression on cylinder #7 & 8. A/F = 10-11.5:1. Octane = _. _ Plugs. CAI. Offroad X-pipe and CB. _ chip. Engine failed at 43k mi. Modded for ~6k mi.

AnonymousT1 (Eaton 2.8” upper, 14 psi, 478/485 rwhp/tq): Minor scoring to #3 piston skirt, no other signs of damage mechanical damage. Accelerated hard with less than 1/8 tank of gas and blew fuel pressure sensor - car developed knock immediately after. A/F = 11.8:1 at peak power. NGK TR6 plugs gapped at 0.035”. Octane = 93. Magnaflow catted X & Steeda CB. SFPHQ CAI, Accufab TB. Failure at 12k mi. Modded at 7k mi.

Grey03Cobra (Eaton, _ psi, 483/503 rwhp/tq): Piston (heat) damage to #7 & 8 occurred after top end high speed run (160 mph). Bassani X, CB & Mid-Length Headers. UPR CAI. Diablo chip. Engine failed at ~18k mi.

Kino (Eaton w/ 3.1” upper 6# lower, 17 psi, 473/_ rwhp/tq): Heat damage to pistons and scuffs on skirts on 3 of them. Damaged pistons appear to be undersized. Blown head gasket. A/F = 12.1:1. Denso IT-22 plugs gapped at 0.030”. Octane = 93. Stock induction system. Stock fuel system. QMP 3” exhaust w/ CATs. Diablo chip. Engine failed at 27.5k mi. Modded for 21k mi.

tommygun (Eaton 2.8” upper, 14 psi, 456/458 rwhp/tq): Piston #7 broke from top down to the ring land resulting in no compression. Failed when racing at > 150 mph. Detonation noted at time of failure. Octane = 91. A/F = 12.2:1 at peak power. NGK TR6 plugs. 11,235 mi when failed (700 mi after tick fix). 5.6k mi modded. Also had exhaust and CAI.

|RageATM| (Eaton 2.75” upper 4# lower, 17 psi, 457/517 rwhp/tq): Heat damage to all pistons, the worst was #2 followed closely by #7 & 8. Suspect new tune caused a lean condition, but A/F was not checked. (Initial tune had A/F = 11.8:1). NGK TR6 plugs. Octane = 93. CAI. Stock fuel system. VRS Catted midpipe and Magnaflow CB. Engine failed at ~16k mi. Modded for ~3k mi.

3snakes1coupe (Eaton w/ 2.8”/4#, 17 psi, >500/? rwhp/tq DJ): 4/26/05. Low compression on 7&8. Heat damage to several pistons & scored skirts, and heat damage to head. A/F =12:1. Total timing = 23 deg. Octane = 93. NGK TR6 plugs. Aftermarket HE. BBK TB, MAFXtender. KB BAP. Magnaflow catted X and CB. Engine failed at 2k mi. Modded for ? mi.

capnkirk52 (Eaton 2.8” upper, _ psi, 330/330 raw (@7645 ft) rwhp/tq on M.D.): Scored skirts of all 8 pistons. Cause unknown, (too much heat, back-to-back dyno runs, 160MPH blast?) A/F = 11.5-12.0:1. Stock plugs. Octane = 91 w/ octane booster. K&N FIPK. Stock fuel system. Bassani O/R X and CB. Total timing = 19 or 22 deg. Engine failed at 3.8 kmi. Modded for 2.3 kmi.

capnkirk52 (Eaton 2.8” upper): Second failure. Teflon on all pistons scored. Suspect result of heat from high-speed runs. Same equipment as before plus Accufab TB and Bassani mid-length headers. Failed at 8 kmi.

Zinc03Cobra (Eaton w/ 2.76” upper, _ psi, _/_ rwhp/tq): Broken right-side head timing chain. NGK TR6 plugs. 12” open K&N. Magnaflow CB. Bassani O/R X. Custom Predator tune. Failed at 21 kmi.

SALEENGTROUSH (Eaton w/ 2.8” upper, _ psi, _/_ rwhp/tq): Heat damage to piston #7 & #8 is scored. Many (>50) high-speed (upwards of 160 mph) runs. Heard detonation during run when it blew. UPR CAI, Mac O/R-H and CB, Custom Predator tune.

SonicSlowbra (Ported Eaton w/ 2.8” upper, _ psi, 490/473 rwhp/tq SAE DJ): Broken piston skirt #7. Suspect timing and heat related. A/F = 12.5:1. NGK TR6. Octane = 93. K&N FIPK. Stock fuel system. XMS HE. Catted X and SLP CB. Diablo chip. Engine failed at 3.1k mi on 9/20/04. Modded for 350 mi.

wjfawb0 (Ported Eaton w/ 2.8” upper, 14-16 psi, 491/471 rwhp/tq SAE): ~10/1/05. Holed piston #2, and #5&6 were running hot. The FPDM failed, which may have damaged the pistons due to random dropping fuel pressure. A/F = 11.5-12. NGK TR6. Octane = 93. Timing = 18. K&N FIPK, Accufab TB and plenum. Dr. Gas O/R X-pipe, Magnaflow CB. Engine failed at ~61 kmi. Pullied since 4.5 kmi.

lucafu1: (Ported Eaton, 2.76” and 3#lower, 16 psi, 531/520 rwhp/tq): 4/05. #2 piston skirt, overheated (after piston skirt May 2005) warped heads, busted radiator, expansion tank and cap. Suspect damage from heat. A/F =12.0. Octane = 93. Denso 22 0.032”. Total timing = 22. Extreme H/E, Apten head cooling mod. JLT RAI w/ SFPHQ MAF adapter/10" power stack, SCT BA2400, Accufab T.B. KB BAP w/ 60# injectors. MRT Gutted Cattted H-Pipe, Borla Stingers. Engine failed at ~11 kmi. Miles since modded = 800.

bross03cobra (Ported Eaton w/ 2.8” & 4#, 15 psi (@5,500 ft), 100 dry shot post MAF, 650/815 rwhp/tq SAE DJ): Broken piston #2. 100 N2O passes, 100 blower only passes, 106 dyno pulls(!!). A/F = 11.1:1 w/ juice (11.5 w/o). Autolite AR103 at 0.032”. Octane = 91 on street (w/o spray) or 103 for track. Total timing = 18 (w/ juice) or 21 (w/o juice), KB BAS. Steeda CAI, Accufab TB and inlet, SCT2400 MAF. KB BAP, 60# SD inj. LPF HE, Apten cooling mod. JBA shorties, Magnaflow catted X and CB. Diablo chip. Engine failed at 18.5 kmi. Modded since 900 mi.

svt1.8t (Ported Eaton stg III, 2.93”/6#, 17 psi, 525/555 rwhp/tq STD DJ): SVTP 12/22/05. Heat damage to piston, #7 40 lbs comp, 4% leakdown,melted straps of spark plug. A/F =11.7. Octane = 94. Timing = 22deg. Denso IT24 at 0.035”. LDD head cooling mod, IC res, LFP HE, LFP radiator, water wetter. JLT RAI, MAFia, Accufab TB. 60# injectors, BAP. O/R Prochamber, Magnaflow CB. Engine failed at 9.2 kmi on 11/1/05. Modded for 3 kmi.

snake679 (Eaton w/ 2.8” upper with 200 wet shot, 14psi, 457/496 rwhp/tq): Bad wrist pin on #6. Broke while on the juice at the track at the end of the run. A/F = 11.7:1. Afco HE. BBK longtubes & O/R X, Magnaflow CB. Predator. Failed at 15k mi.

cobra93teal (Eaton w/ 2.8” upper, 15 psi, 520 (!) rwhp, ? tq on DJ): 2/5/05. Heat damage to pistons #3 & #7. Damaged during high-speed run. Octane = 93. NGK TR6. Total timing = ?. CAI. Stock fuel sys. Borla CB. Modded for 17 kmi. Engine failed at 31 kmi on 12/28/04.

Zinc03Cobra (KB, 15 psi, 530/? rwhp/tq): ~11/6/05. Heat damage to piston #7. Experienced lean condition. A/F = 11.3. Timing = ?. Octane = 91. MAFia, 12” open K&N. 60# injectors, KB BAP. Magnaflow CB. Bassani O/R X. LFP HE, LFP IC Tank. Custom Predator tune. Failed at 15 kmi (on engine).

RaceRat (KB, 15.5 psi, 604 rwhp): Heat damage to all pistons, #7 & 8 were worst. A/F was very safe up to 6200rpm, but climbing to 12:1 at 6400rpm. Suspect inadequate fuel system.

GodStang (2.2L KB w/ 3” upper, 17 psi, ?/? rwhp/tq): Piston #7 and #8 melted heavily, damage to heads. Suspect lack of fuel (bad A/F). Supercharger damage (gouges in the rotors.) Tune details unknown. Stock cooling and fuel system. NGK TR-6. CAI. Bassani high-flow cats, and Catback. Engine failed at 15 kmi. (godstang was not the orig owner – purchased car after failure and is rebuilding it.)

Coleman (KB 3” upper 6# lower, 17+ psi, 549/535 rwhp/tq): Piece broke off of piston #6 and spun rod bearing. Suspect vacuum leak caused lean condition and detonation. A/F = 12.0:1 at peak power. Denso IT-24 plugs. Octane = 93. Stock fuel system. Stock heat exchanger. KB CAI and TB. 3” QMP exhaust. Engine failed at 20.5k mi. Modded for 10k mi.

gussin1 (KB, 17 psi, 583/519 rwhp/tq DJ): Extremely low compression on cylinder 7(49psi) 8(51psi), and 4(120psi)...150-160PSI is normal. Now suspect due to bad tune, although no detonation was recognized. A/F = 11.9:1 at peak power. Autolite 103 plugs at 0.032”. Octane = 91. KB BAP, 60# injectors. C&L 95mm MAF, K&N filter, Accufab TB. Gords HE. Magnaflow catted-X and CB. Modded for ~5k mi. Engine failed at ~7k mi. Modded at 500 mi with all the bolt ons to 473rwhp/474tq, put the KB on at 5.5k mi, engine blew around 6.2k mi.

Justin Blake (KB, 17 psi, _/_ rwhp/tq): 4/8/05. The motor was removed and inspected and what happened was the crank was shoved forward and was not returning properly which cause the rear thrust bearing to slowly come apart which sent shaving throughout the motor which completely ruined everything; block, crank and bent several rods also. A/F = 11.5. SCT MAF. Focus pumps, 60# injectors. K&N FIPK. Magnaflow X and CB. Pullied at 2 kmi, ported Eaton at 2.8 kmi, KB at 2.85 kmi. Engine failed at 3 kmi.

Shadowgray03 (KB, 17-18 psi, 600 rwhp DJ): Heat damage, pistons #5 & #7 are the worst. Ring on number 5 is actually seized in the ring land. Head damage (partially melted) on #5 & 7 as well. Detonation noted, and oil out of exhaust at time of failure at an engine speed of ~ 5500 rpm. A/F = 11.8:1 at peak power. AP103 plugs at 0.035”. Octane = 92 non oxy or 93/94. Modded for ~5k mi. Engine failed at ~7k mi.

seidler (2.2L KB, 18 psi, ?/? rwhp/tq): 10/30/05. Holed piston #2. #2 and #4 had plug ground straps melted. All cyl on right side oil covered. Suspect detonation. A/F = 11.7. Timing = 18. Octane = 93. Ford A12 at 0.030”. JLT CAI 12", KB TB, BA2400. 60 lb injectors, KB BAP. LDC Cooling Mod, GordFord HE. Magnaflow CB and Catted X. Custom I/C reservoir. Engine failed at 8.2 kmi. 6.7 kmi w/ modded Eaton, 1.5 kmi w/ KB.

03Steve (KB, _ psi, _/_ rwhp/tq): – will provide more data when he gets engine apart.

toofast4u (2.2L KB 3” upper, 17 psi, 566/505 STD rwhp/tq on MD): 1/12/05. Oil and low compression (<150 psi) in cyl #7. Smoking at startup. Suspect broken ring. A/F = 11.8:1. NGK TR6 at 0.035”. Octane = 93. Total timing = 21 deg at 6.5 krpm. LFP HE w/ 9.5” fans. SCT MAF, Accufab TB, Steeda CAI. Focus pumps and 60# injectors. QMP manifold back with straight through mufflers . Modded for ~11 kmi w/KB. Engine failed at 21 kmi.

WUTWHNE (2.2L KB 3.0” upper, 17 psi, 591/506 rwhp/tq): 5/12/05. Suspect cylinder #5 is down. Suspect due to ?. A/F = 11.8-11.9:1. Octane = 91. NGK TR6 at 0.035”. Total timing = 21-22 deg. Elevation = 4500-5000 ft. Stock cooling system. K&N FIPK, Accufab TB, MAFia. KB BAP, 60# injectors. Borla Stinger CB, Bassani X-pipe w/cats. Diablo chip. Failed at 24k mi. Modded for 2k mi.

HotWheels (2.2L KB, 21 psi, 622 lb-ft, 548 hp @ ~5 krpm when eng went): 6/7/05. No. 4 piston holed and cyl head damage. Looks like detonation. Engine failed while on dyno during tuning session. A/F = 11.7. KB BAP, 60# injectors. SCT MAF, CAI. Bassani mid-length headers and CB. Aftermarket HE.

reddragon (Whipple 3” pulley, 19 psi, 487/548 rwhp/tq MD): 4/2/05. Failed on DJ dyno (after tuning on MD dyno). Piston damage from suspected detonation. Pitting and melted regions. A/F = 11.5:1. Octane = 93. Total timing = 22 deg. UPR CAI, BBK long tube headers, O/R X, and Borla stinger CB. Siemens 60# injectors w/ TRKs, dual Focus pumps. Engine failed at 31 kmi. Whipple moded since ~29 kmi.

stangd1909 (Whipple 3.24”/4#, 20 psi, 609/595 rwhp/tq): 8/13/05. Damage unknown yet. A/F = ?. Octane = 93. Total timing = 21 deg. LFP HE & IC tank. Accufab TB, Steeda CAI or JLT RAI. BAP, 60# injectors. Magnaflow CB, UPR O/R X-pipe. Engine failed at 3 kmi. Modded for 2.5 kmi.

8URZ-28 (Whipple, 3.0”/2#, _ psi, _/_ rwhp/tq): 9/24/05. Loss of power after high speed run (~140 mph). Coolant spewage from overflow tank. Knocking sound at idle and smoke out exhaust. NGK TR6. KB BAP, 60# injectors, MAFia. Amazon CAI, Accufab TB. MRT H-pipe, Borla Stingers.

John Himsel (Whipple 3.25”/4#, 19 psi, ?/? RWHP/TQ): 7/24/05. #6 cylinder is toast....piston damage, valve damage, scuffed cylinder wall.....left exhaust smokes really bad. A/F = 11.9:1. Octane = 93. NGK TR-6. Total timing = 21. Gords HE, NPI IC. Accufab TB, SCT MAF. 60 # inj, custom rails, ½” fuel line, Focus pumps. Bassani mid-length headers, O/R X, CB. Engine failed at 10.5 kmi.
Miles at time of engine failure: 10.5 kmi. Modded for only 75 mi

Badass_Forever

iTrader: (1)

rich, go get that silver 04 across the street!

SilknSteel

iTrader: (1)

My car aint napping, I aint naggin an I don't have any screaming kids around lol
The conclusion of this.........MEN WHINE TOO MUCH !!!
Sorry I couldn't resist

And I'd go for the Mach imho

Terminal Velocity

in the good words of Cartmen from south park
"women get in the kitchen and bake me some pie!"J/K LOL